Susan Friedmann [00:00:30]:
Welcome to Book Marketing Mentors, the weekly podcast where you learn proven strategies, tools, ideas, and tips from the masters. Every week, I introduce you to a marketing master who will share their expertise to help you market and sell more books. Today, my special guest is certified global executive leadership coach, Brenda Bence. Brenda helps both international leaders and companies achieve greater success from the inside out. She's authored 11 award winning books on coaching, leadership, and branding, with sales of over a 100000 copies. She's known globally as a pioneer in the field of leadership, personal branding, and has been recognized by the world leader in coaching by Thinkers50, and Global Gurus ranks her in the top 10 coach and branding experts. Running her own thriving business from offices in both Singapore and the US, Brenda has coached hundreds of executives across 6 continents representing 60 nationalities and 70 industries, all the way from Singapore. Brenda, it's an absolute honor to welcome you to the show, and thank you for being this week's guest expert and mentor.

Brenda Bence [00:01:53]:
Thank you, Susan. It's a privilege to be communicating with you. You and I have known each other for many years, so it's lovely to reconnect.

Susan Friedmann [00:02:01]:
Well, thank you. And, yes, I mean, I had another guest, Nir. I was telling you about him, and he was from Singapore. I love it when we have this international aspect of this show. It's lovely. It just makes my heart just nice, warm and fuzzy because I love traveling. I love just visiting and being with people. And how great is this that I'm, you know, in in lake Plaza in New York and you're in Singapore? I don't know how many thousands of miles away that is, but it's a long way.

Susan Friedmann [00:02:34]:
You've got so much wisdom, Brenda. And you and I were just chit chatting a little bit before the show, talking about what would be most helpful to our audience. And one of the things that you said that I want to really tap into is that you sell books to corporate. And this is a market that I think is one of those it's low hanging fruit, I feel, but yet so many authors don't even know how to go about selling books into corporate, and you've done an amazing job with this. Let's start there and talk a little bit about that, and then we'll move on because I know you've got 7 different revenue streams, and I want to tap into that as well because with a book, there are so many ways that you can make money and authors are always looking to do that. Let's start off with, how do we sell books into corporate?

Brenda Bence [00:03:37]:
Well, it's a great question. And it is a, quite a captive audience once you get in, and they like you, and they'll have the next book you launch and the next book and the next book, they'll keep having you back and back. So it's it's not just getting in the first time, it's coming back again and again and again. So, I'm going to share a few techniques that we've used for how to get into corporates. There are so many. We can always come back if we don't have enough time. But the first thing I do is we have massive book launches for the new book. When I say massive, I mean we rent out a big ballroom in a hotel, we invite guests from corporates to come.

Brenda Bence [00:04:11]:
We'll have a speaker, an emcee. I speak on the book. We sell books in the back of the room. You can sell several hundred every time. Now why? Because when those corporates are standing in that room and they're getting a book, what happens and I do a physical book. Try to I don't do ebooks and I do launch ebooks, but I don't sell them in those venues. I want them to have it in their hands. First of all, they're going to understand more about my topic.

Brenda Bence [00:04:37]:
Secondly, that that book is going to be in their office bookshelf. I have had many clients that say, oh, I was in so and so's office the other day and I saw one of your books on his bookshelf. So don't underestimate the power of having that physical book in people's hands. And when I got the right people in the room for those types of book launches, you just get them in the hands of the right people. They can book you for speaking, coaching, consulting, and whatever else. It's a nice virtuous circle. And that really helps a lot. You know, you get those corporate clients coming to those concentrated books.

Brenda Bence [00:05:11]:
And, of course, book events, and you sign the book and all that type of thing. And I have little bookmarks too that kind of outline the key topics in that book so that they get a free bookmark, which, of course, has got my name, my email, and all that information on it too. So it's a very easy way to remember the book and my advice. And another one is leveraging the CEOs. So when it comes time to write a new book, as you're in the process of writing your next book or your latest book or whatever, I'm looking for testimonials. So you reach out to corporate leaders and you say, I'd love to get one from you. Now a lot of corporate leaders love the idea of being in a book. They've never been in a book before.

Brenda Bence [00:05:54]:
So, you know, I'll go as high as I possibly can. And at this stage of my career, I can get the c suite for sure, but, you know, the head of HR, the head of whatever, if you're in operations, whatever. And just say, would you be willing to do a testimonial? Now, people love to see their name published in a book, especially if it's a really good book and it's a topic that they like. So, just go to those CEOs, go to leaders and say, would you be willing? And then help them out, come up with your own testimonials, some example testimonials. In fact, I even number them. 1, 2, 3, 4, 5, down to 12. Say, which one would you like? And they'll say, I'll take 8. Because honestly, they don't have the time to write them themselves because they don't know how to.

Brenda Bence [00:06:35]:
That helps them as well. And so now, when they get their name in the book, guess what? They're gonna go talking to all their friends and say, hey, hey, here's my book. And in fact, I've even had corporate execs who I met. I asked one of them to do a testimonial, and when he got it, he was from Hungary, and I was in Thailand at the time. He said, you know, I love this so much. Let me buy 75 and give it to his group or his division. So some companies will say, we want our whole company to have a copy. That's when you get several 1,000 right up to bat, right from the very start.

Brenda Bence [00:07:08]:
Sometimes, we'll also customize the book. If the CEO is interested enough, I leave a blank page at the front, and that's for the forward. So the CEO will say, I'd love to have you write the forward, and it's gonna be sold to your company specifically if they have a big enough event or whatever. And it's great. And then when they see that forward, it can talk about how this topic of the book applies to them and what they're talking about. I didn't write a book on DEI, but one of my books could relate to diversity, equity, and inclusion. And the CEO was trying to push that as part of this person's agenda for the whole company. They ended up buying this book and putting a forward in it, which had all of the reasons why DE and I was really important for their particular company, and they bought 1,000 and, sent them out to all the individuals that were impacted, and the CEO loved it.

Brenda Bence [00:08:02]:
Sitting on their bookshelf, you know, they now have something that they're proud of to put on their bookshelf as well. That's another example. And let me do one more. And then I do what's called e blast, Susan. Whenever I do a speaking or coaching or a training or whatever it might be, I'll ask them if they would like to be included in an e blast. Now what an e blast is, is something that is set up just through constant contact, And it's meant that for every 6 months, every 2 weeks, whoever is the coaching client or the group that I spoke to or the audience for the keynote, I get their emails from the corporation and their companies give me their emails or they can sign up directly. I'm going to say, look, on this topic related to this book, I'm going to send you a new tip, a new tool, a new technique every 2 weeks for 6 months. Now, what happens is they're customized and very simple to set up, but it has new tips, new topics, new tools, and people just love them.

Brenda Bence [00:09:02]:
And so what happens, they're preprogrammed all the way to the end. I just set them out to go out. And then at the end, I encourage them to sign up for my regular newsletter too. So all those people I've ever spoken to over the years and all the people I've ever coached over the years for any particular topic that they sign up for, they stay in touch on the newsletter. And let me tell you, that has brought in tons of business. During COVID, I sent out more newsletters than normal, and I got so many people saying, we're so hungry for something. Let's do this online. Let's do a speaking.

Brenda Bence [00:09:38]:
Let's do a coaching, whatever. Those are things that I do as well. That kind of e blast, that helps.

Susan Friedmann [00:09:44]:
That e blast, is that something that you charge for, or is that just a service that you offer to people within a certain company?

Brenda Bence [00:09:51]:
Well, it's a great question. If I hike up my speaking fee or my coaching fee enough, I will make it complimentary. It doesn't cost me a lot. It doesn't cost me anything except for a team's talent, right, to set it up. And it's always set up so that it's just ready to plug in the name of the company and the logo and so forth. But it it makes the service I provide more premium, so they're willing to pay more for it. I mean, they're willing to pay a higher fee in general anyway. So I don't actually make it an add on because lots of people say, no.

Brenda Bence [00:10:21]:
No. I don't want that. But if I just say, and it's included in the fee, and then they're like, oh, okay. Great. But they don't know I've already increased my fee a little bit to cover the cost of that.

Susan Friedmann [00:10:31]:
Okay. Excellent. One of the things as you were talking earlier with fabulous ideas is getting these c suite men, women to come to an event. What is the reason that they would want to come? You say you have these massive events, and I'm thinking, woah, are people actually going to come?

Brenda Bence [00:10:54]:
Yeah. A couple of things. Number 1, they often already know me, and so they know that, normally, they have to pay for my services to speak. So I say I'll be speaking on this topic at this event. Right? There'll be, you know, a buffet. There'll be something to eat or drink. And so a lot of them will just come for that or they're interested. Or if they don't make it, they'll send their chief human resources officer, or they'll send someone from the company as a representative.

Brenda Bence [00:11:20]:
So it really is about just getting them interested and excited about the new topic and how it might apply to them. Now I do know some people who offer that kind of thing and say, if you'll come, we'll make sure you get free book and da da da. I don't do that. I'm like, no. You have to buy the book. And I think there's something to that. Like, if you give away too much for free, people don't think it has a lot of value. But if you say, look, just tonight, we're gonna have a slightly discounted amount, and here's what it is.

Brenda Bence [00:11:50]:
And they're like, yeah. Let's do this. It may not be the CEO or the whatever coming, but it's gonna be a representative from that company who will go back to that company and say, hey. This is really good. We should get this person in to speak or to coach or to do training. And let's be honest, and you know this as well as anybody, you don't make the money from selling the book. You make the money from all the revenue streams that come from selling that book.

Susan Friedmann [00:12:16]:
Which is a fabulous segue, thank you, Brenda, of going into revenue streams because, yes, you're absolutely right. I mean, I say those words almost every time I speak to an author, is that you do not make money on the book. It's rather these extra revenue streams. So let's tap into that because I know, as we said, that's where the money is. So let's talk about revenue streams.

Brenda Bence [00:12:43]:
We have 7 revenue streams, our company. And the way I kinda look at it, it's almost like the book. It's like a you know, the hub and spoke of a wheel. Right? You have the hub and you have all the spokes that come off of it. I think the book is the hub, and the spokes are all the possible revenue streams that can come from that. And so when I launch a new book, I'm going to launch coaching around that topic. I'm going to launch speaking around that topic. I'm going to launch corporate training events around that.

Brenda Bence [00:13:10]:
I'm going to do some retainer work around that with corporates. I'll launch an online course on that, etcetera. So, it's really the hub. And then from that can come so many different topics and so many different revenue streams. And one of the things that we do, we call it blackout bingo. It's the idea that I'm gonna take a corporate client, let's say corporation x y z. And corporation XYZ, if I talk on this topic, let's say leadership branding, okay, if I talk on that, well, I'm going to say, did I get them to do coaching on that topic? Did I get them to hire me for a speech on that topic? Did I get them to hire me for a training on that topic? Did they sign up for their online course for that topic? And every time they do, I'm gonna blackout a little I'm gonna make a little blackout in their line on that blackout bingo line. And my goal is to fill out the whole blackout bingo, right, is to fill out the whole line.

Brenda Bence [00:14:07]:
That one company has done every possible option on our revenue streams, if it's appropriate for their company. And then what's of course, because when you have more than one book, then you pay, okay, that same corporation, now we're going to do this book. Right? And we're going to work so the whole idea is that you're going to black out the whole bingo card with all the things that they've engaged you to do because it drives so many different revenue streams. A book does. Yeah.

Susan Friedmann [00:14:34]:
That's fantastic. I love that idea. Blackout Bingo. That's a fun game to play. Is there a certain size company who you target, or an industry that you specialise in? I mean, you've covered so many different industries. How do you go about finding brand new clients? Yes, you've got a reputation, and people often now come to you. But let's talk about it from a beginner standpoint, you know. What would you recommend to first time authors to even get some of this started?

Brenda Bence [00:15:11]:
Yeah. Well, first of all, I work across a wide variety of of industries because I like to, But it doesn't mean that you have to. Like, I know a lot of people who they wanna focus on the nursing business or the hospital business or whatever. That's fine. There is enough business in there for everybody if you do it right. And the key thing for me is so we have a 97% repeat or referral rate. That means that every time we get in front of a client, out of 10 clients, 9.7 of them are gonna hire us again. Okay? So that comes from outstanding, excellent customer service, making sure that we're getting out in front of everything before, during, and after the event, you know, all the things we would typically do to make sure we're holding up to really high excellence.

Brenda Bence [00:15:57]:
We call our own, this is the white glove service. Everything we do is very white glove. Now, we also deal with very large corporations, but it wasn't always that way. When I first started, we worked with companies that weren't that big. Now, at a point in my career where I'm working with all the multibillion dollar businesses, right, That's really my sweet spot. But if we didn't start there, so I really wanna make sure that's clear. What do you do? Well, you get into some way, whether they come to your book launch, whether you send an email, whether you send them a book or a snippet of the book to say this would be applicable to you, etcetera. Once you get in and once you deliver outstanding service, outstanding outcomes, make sure you get feedback from them, what went well, what didn't go well.

Brenda Bence [00:16:43]:
What will happen is then you have the guess, not the right, but you have the willingness and capability to go to them and say, you know, I'm so glad that you were happy with our service on x y z services. I would love to talk to someone else within your organization who would be interested in this. Could you please share with me 3 to 5 people who you believe would also really benefit from getting this information and working with me. It has never failed to turn into more business. Never. So you say, give me those people's names, make kind introduction, etcetera. They introduce you. They're in the same company.

Brenda Bence [00:17:19]:
Right? So you know that it's going to go pretty well because they're not gonna introduce people who are in a totally competitive company or anything like that. So you already know enough about that company to talk knowledgeably about the issues that are going on in that company because you've already dealt with one of the divisions or what have you. And because of that, it just snowballs. I remember when I first started out with my own company, and I did that. I went to a corporation, very large corporation, and I got an opportunity to work with them. I asked within the same division, do you have? I asked within other divisions, can you give me names? Can I ask internationally? Can you give me the names internationally of people in Europe, of people in South America, etcetera? And that just snowballs. It just snowballs. The answer was always no unless you ask.

Brenda Bence [00:18:09]:
And I was fine to take rejections. It was okay. You'd be surprised most of the time if you've delivered outstanding service, outstanding outcomes for them, they'll be happy to recommend you. We'd like to help other people that have done good for us. So I hope that answers your question, but really just keep the snowball going, and don't be afraid to ask for referrals and references.

Susan Friedmann [00:18:31]:
From what I hear you saying, I mean, there's a deliberate plan in terms of you deliver, you know, your keynote or the coaching, the training that you're doing, but then from there, once they love you, when you as you say, you've delivered results for them, then you're asking for referrals, somebody else in the company, and specifically, are you asking for certain positions in that company? Could you introduce me, let's say, to marketing or to HR or to whichever department? Or are you just saying, who else in your organization could benefit from the services I offer?

Brenda Bence [00:19:12]:
The answer is the latter for me. It's who else do you know would benefit? And the reason I do that, if I were someone who was in operations and I wanted to focus on operations because that's my topic, then I would ask for operations. But my topics are such that they cover a broad spectrum within the corporation itself. My topic, I can talk high, low, and across. I'm very fortunate in that regard. But if you have, like I said, a topic that's related to marketing and you really want to get into marketing, then you would ask specifically for people in marketing. You just tailor it to yourself. But the key is to ask, and to ask in a way where they get to do you a favor.

Brenda Bence [00:19:50]:
If you've been good to them and you've really given them service above and beyond, they will be happy to support you. And if they aren't, it's a great opportunity to have a conversation with them and learn more about what you're doing right and what you could be doing better because that's how we just get better and better and better over

Susan Friedmann [00:20:06]:
time. Practice makes perfect. I love that idea of reciprocity that people want to help you, and you've given something to them, and they want to return it in some way. That's beautiful.

Brenda Bence [00:20:19]:
And, Susan, can I just say one more thing? Also, within organizations, and I don't want this to come across in any way negative or anything, but there are certain people that would be like your creme de la creme, like the people you would love to be able to work with. Right? Would be the c suite. And then there's the people that are like the next level now, and then there's people next level down. I call them the ABCs. A, B, and C. Start with the Cs. Practice with the Cs. Practice with the people who you feel are pretty happy to work with you anyway.

Brenda Bence [00:20:47]:
They're gonna be, Yeah. Yeah. Sure. Let's do that. Then you can say, Can you help me talk to people at this level? And then once you're comfortable with them, the b's, then you move to the a's. So by the time you get to the a level, clients that you'd really love to work with, you've got plenty of practice under your belt. You've made all your little mistakes here and there that you won't do again, and you'll feel far more confident addressing those a level clients.

Susan Friedmann [00:21:12]:
And that's so funny because I often say to people, yes, don't focus on the top in the industry. Focus on what I call the Avis companies, the companies that are trying harder to, you know, like, be the Hertz. It's the same, you know, concept. You're just doing it within one company, starting off with the lower level. I mean, you've got so much bureaucracy often within corporations about getting financing and all of that. You can jump through hoops sometimes with all of this. Are there any tricks of the trade that you could share with our listeners?

Brenda Bence [00:21:51]:
You're right. There are there are some that are going to sign very quickly. I just signed a really big deal last week and it took a very short time. I've had another one I'm working on right now. It's been 9 months. I mean, they just take a long time sometimes. What that teaches me is I probably won't work with the 9 month corporation again because it's not worth my time and my energy. But you live and learn as you go along, and you keep track of who moves quickly and who doesn't.

Brenda Bence [00:22:15]:
And, honestly, those ones that move quickly just feel better too. Right? But in terms of moving it along, you know, it's, again, customer service, customer service, customer service. How can I be supportive of you? What is your budget? What could we do within that budget? That's really important, by the way. You know, people say to me they'll say, oh, but the budget's this, and I wanna charge this. And I say never charge this without elements to it. Right? I'm gonna speak on this topic. It includes an hour speech. It includes I don't usually do this, but q and a, And it includes a book that's gonna be part of it.

Brenda Bence [00:22:51]:
So everyone who walks away from that engagement will have a book and they're gonna get e blast. Now when they come back to me and they say, oh, it's just that's too steep. We can't do that. We don't have the budget. I'll say, well, of these elements, what would you like to take out? Now the one that I will most never take out is the book. Why? Because I want them all to have a book. It's better than a business card. It's gonna be sitting on their desks.

Brenda Bence [00:23:13]:
They're gonna be looking at it. They're gonna learn more about me. I wanna keep the book. The other things that they want to take them off, I can slowly, you know, kinda say, okay. Well, we could do for this amount. But the truth is, I wanna get them a book in their hands and to be in front of them because I say a speech or a coaching is not successful if at least 5 people don't come up to me after I've gotten done speaking and say, okay. We gotta have you you you gotta come talk to my group. So it's just that beautiful, synergistic, let's make it happen type of thing.

Susan Friedmann [00:23:45]:
That's beautiful. I love that. And, again, you're reinforcing something that I love to say, is that everybody in the audience should have a copy of your book. Somehow you get the you know, no back of the room sales. That's for the birds, you know,

Brenda Bence [00:24:01]:
taking bits of clay.

Susan Friedmann [00:24:03]:
That's awful. Yes.

Brenda Bence [00:24:05]:
I've never done it. And in fact, that's how I got into selling them in bulk upfront because I was like, I don't wanna sell in the back of the room. I just don't wanna do that. It doesn't feel comfortable. And so I just started adding it as part of the package. And over time, the value equation looks bigger and bigger and better and better, and we just end up selling more books.

Susan Friedmann [00:24:26]:
Yes.

Brenda Bence [00:24:26]:
And making it part of the

Susan Friedmann [00:24:28]:
I know that you self-publish, and so 100% of the profits are yours. And the same when they work with Aviva Publishing, they keep all the profits from the book. It's a win-win for them with the books as well. So it's another revenue generator. Brenda, you have shared so many incredible tips for our listeners. And I know that they are chomping at the bit to find out how they would find out more about you, or the way you do your work. What would be the best way that they could find out more about your books, find out more about you, your speaking engagements?

Brenda Bence [00:25:10]:
Yeah. Sure. The best place to go is to my website, www.brendabence.com, and all my services are listed there and all my books are listed there. I'm gonna give you a sense of my background, where I come from, what I do. I'm always happy to engage on LinkedIn as well. Post regularly there, new content, new thought leadership, so happy to connect that way too.

Susan Friedmann [00:25:32]:
Beautiful. And I'll put those links in the show notes for our listeners. And Brenda, we always end off, as you know, leaving a golden nugget for our listeners. What are your final words of wisdom?

Brenda Bence [00:25:46]:
Well, I think you're already talking to people who have already published, possibly already are in the publishing realm, that I always say do something every week at a minimum for your book. It's like having a child. Right? Everyone thinks the birthing process is the part of it. You know, I launched the book. Yay. And, yeah, maybe I got to Amazon, great selling, whatever. But it's like a child. You wouldn't birth the child and just say, okay, let's move on.

Brenda Bence [00:26:15]:
You raise that child. And so, if you really want to be successful as a book author, you do something at least every week. At the beginning, I do something every day of the week, at least one thing. Have a long list of all the possible things you could do to support that book, everything that you could possibly do to support that book. And then once a day for the 1st 6 months, and then after that, once a week for ongoing every single week. What can I do to support this book? Whether it's a podcast, whether it's writing an article, whatever it might be, it's your baby. You need to raise it the way you would raise a child that you loved.

Susan Friedmann [00:26:53]:
It's so funny. I'm hearing my words coming out of your mouth. It's so beautiful. I love it. I didn't even tell you about that.

Brenda Bence [00:27:01]:
So Oh, yes.

Susan Friedmann [00:27:02]:
It's so true because people say to me, oh, will you market my book for me, or who can I get to market my book? And I was like, this is your child. What would you do? You're you're giving it to somebody else to raise? No. This is yours to raise, and you're the best person to sell this book.

Brenda Bence [00:27:20]:
And no one will love it the way you love it. Exactly. And when you can bring that passion to everything you do, people feel it. You know, people love to talk to authors that just aren't passionate about their topics. So it's a lifetime endeavor. It is not one and done, you know? You keep it going and keep it going and keep it going.

Susan Friedmann [00:27:40]:
Yeah. I know. I've I've had authors say to me, well, how long do I have to keep marketing my book? And I say, well, how long do you want to sell your book? How long do you want to keep it out there? Because it is all about marketing, and it's not one and done once you've finished, you know, the end on your computer or however you write your book. So, yes. No, this is brilliant. Brenda, this has been amazing. Thank you so, so much for sharing your wisdom. And listeners, you've heard so much today in terms of what you could be doing for your book.

Susan Friedmann [00:28:16]:
And I want to offer you another way, and that is for you and I to brainstorm ways in which we can ramp up those sales. Because you've invested a whole lot of time, money and energy, and it's time you got the return you were hoping for. So go to BookMarketingBrainstorm.com
and schedule a free call with me. In the meantime, I hope this interview sparks some ideas you can use to sell more books. Until next week, here's wishing you much book and author marketing success.

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