00:00:00 - Susan Friedmann

Welcome to Book Marketing Mentors, the weekly podcast where you learn proven strategies, tools, ideas, and tips from the masters. Every week, I introduce you to a marketing master who will share their expertise to help you market and sell more books. Today. My special guest is Carol Amato. Imagine discovering your passion in fourth grade, because that's exactly what Carol did when she knew with absolute certainty that she wanted to be a writer. Fast forward today and she's not only accomplished that goal, but she's also an editor and author of 30 books and over 200 articles. Her impressive resume includes TV and radio appearances. But what really sets Carol apart is her ability to teach others how to share their expertise through writing. As a nonfiction book coach, she helps entrepreneurs and business owners transform their expertise into a tangible book form, helping them boost sales and visibility in the process. Carol, it's an absolute pleasure to welcome you to the show, and thank you for being this week's guest expert and mentor.

00:01:13 - Carol Amato

Thank you for having me. I enjoyed being here.

00:01:16 - Susan Friedmann

So we were talking before the show, and one of the geniuses, I think your superpower is talking about book reviews. You and I know the importance of it, but let's share that with our listeners first, the importance of a book review on the success of your book.

00:01:39 - Carol Amato

Well, this is one area that the majority of new writers, especially and self published writers in general, just completely miss. They think you put your book up on Amazon, and if you put it up there, people are just going to find it automatically, and that's not the case at all. You want your book to be noticed, and in a good way. Reviews increase the credibility because you have someone's expert opinion saying that this is a good book and I recommend that people read it. So based on reviewers, your book will climb the ladder of success. Now, think about famous people who endorse products on television. People are more enticed to buy those products because they see Michael Jordan or somebody endorsing it. It's the same with the books. If you have some famous writer or famous person in your field promoting it, then people are more inclined to buy it because they don't know who you are.

00:02:40 - Susan Friedmann

And I know that whether it's a product or a book, one of the first things I do is to read the reviews. I like to read maybe not only the five star reviews, but the four star and the three star as well, because I just want a sense of why somebody wasn't maybe 100% giving the person a five star review. I'd like to know that side of it as well.

00:03:05 - Carol Amato

Absolutely. That's the thing. When you send your book out for review, there's no guarantee it's going to be a good review. You could get some negative comments, in which case you need to improve the next time around based on those comments. Luckily, lots of times the reviews are good. I have in the past read books that were so terrible that I didn't review them at all because I thought, there's nothing good I can say, and I didn't think that was fair either.

00:03:34 - Susan Friedmann

That's an interesting one, too, is that people not doing that. Now, how do you get people to actually write the review? Because you might ask them to do that, but getting them to actually do it is a very different game altogether.

00:03:52 - Carol Amato

First of all, it's necessary to understand that there are two types of reviews. One is a testimonial from someone well known in your field or your genre, and you may or may not know them already. You approach them, ask them if they would do a review, they read the book or the synopsis or whatever it is that they've asked for. Then they're willing to provide their endorsement. The other type is a reader review. And those are reviews from people after your book is published. And you have no control over that at all. Well, actually, I should add a third type in there, the professional book reviewer. Not just someone well known in your field, but someone who reviews books for a living. Those you have no idea whether they will agree to do it or not. You can send your materials in. They may or may not review the book, may or may not be a good review. Testimonials are what you want to go after first, people who are going to say something good about your book. So we'll talk about that too. If you're with a major publisher, they will handle this whole process regarding the reviews. But the testimonials are up to you. And if you're with a small press, they may not handle it at all. So again, it's going to be up to you. And if you're self published, the whole process is up to you.

00:05:12 - Susan Friedmann

Yes, because one of the questions that I often get from authors is how do I get testimonials for my book? Yes, asking people. But again, people with the best will in the world will say yes, but actually getting to do it. And then you're bugging them to do it, and people don't like to do that.

00:05:32 - Carol Amato

Okay, well, there's a secret to that, that you write the blurb yourself and ask them if they will agree to put their name to it. Then it's just a matter of yes or no. Now, the trick is not to send the same blurb to more than one person. So all you need is a sentence or two. A review is many, many paragraphs. A testimonial is a line or two. That's it. So if you can make those up and then send them out. But there's a process there too. You don't want to hit the person cold if they get a message from Joe Blow, a person they've never heard of, why would they even say yes. So you want to get to know these people first by commenting on their social media posts, going to conferences, if you can, where they're speaking, and getting to know them in person, and then approach them afterwards when they know who you are.

00:06:30 - Susan Friedmann

Yes. I love that technique. It's one that I definitely recommend to my authors is write maybe six to ten different testimonials that you would like to see about your book, and then, as you rightly said, send them to people. Not all of them, but just saying, hey, would you put your name to this particular testimonial? They may want to rewrite it. People don't know how to write testimonials. That's been my experience.

00:07:00 - Carol Amato

Well, okay, there's another issue. So I would do a little research on the Internet. Look at testimonials on Amazon that have been written for other people's books. Maybe you can model yours after some of those that sound really good. There are ways to get around that. But yes, the marketing writing of any kind is very difficult, regardless of how well of an author you are or how good of an author you are. Because it's just a different type of writing.

00:07:29 - Susan Friedmann

Yes, because it's got to be very succinct, but at least have a message of why you like it. It's not just, oh, I like this book. It's Why did you like it? What did it do for you? Something of that nature.

00:07:42 - Carol Amato

Now, here's one caveat there. I've read a lot of even reviews that are nothing but a summary of the plot or summary of the chapters that are in the book that is not a review or a testimonial. A testimonial, like you just said, tells you what you liked about it, what you didn't like. I've read a lot of books that I thought were great. I put up a review on them on Amazon. But I did point out that there were a lot of typographical errors, and that sometimes ruins the reading a bit. In one case, it didn't really interrupt the quality of the writing. But there's no excuse for having a.

00:08:23 - Susan Friedmann

Book full of typos, not if you've had it professionally edited.

00:08:27 - Carol Amato

Absolutely. And I think that's the other area that people skip, and that's before you ever approach anyone for a testimonial or a review, your book has to be professionally edited and the COVID has to be designed professionally. Also, your book has to look like it came out of New York, even if it didn't.

00:08:49 - Susan Friedmann

And that's the standard that we really like at Aviva Publishing, is if you see an Aviva Publishing book on a bookshelf in a bookstore and a traditionally published book, that you couldn't tell the difference.

00:09:04 - Carol Amato

Absolutely.

00:09:05 - Susan Friedmann

What we want yes.

00:09:06 - Carol Amato

Big name people are not going to put their name to a book that looks schlocky and is poorly produced. It ruins their credibility, and your content could be fabulous. But when that old saying, people don't judge a book by its cover? Well, they do. So it has to be top quality. Writing has to be good too. I'm editing a book right now where the writer has fabulous information, but it's wordy, wordy, wordy, wordy, wordy. So stripping it down to the concrete information is so necessary. That's why you need a professional edit.

00:09:47 - Susan Friedmann

It's so funny because when authors come and I ask them whether they've had their book edited and they said, oh, yes, my friend's a high school teacher and she's going to do it or she's doing it, I was like, no, I don't think that's exactly quite the editing we're looking for.

00:10:03 - Carol Amato

No, not exactly. Your content has to flow. Sentence structure has to be conversational and friendly. There's a whole lot more to it than just proofreading, grammar and punctuation.

00:10:16 - Susan Friedmann

Yes, I totally agree with that. Is there a cycle in terms of book reviews? Should you be asking people before the book is published, or you wait until the book is published? What's your recommendation?

00:10:33 - Carol Amato

Yes, there's a definite book review cycle, and this is something else that most writers are unaware of. You have to start this process way back while you're still writing the book. You may only have a chapter or two done. That's all you need to show someone the quality of what you're writing is going to be. Let's take this in order. Let's say you want to get ten to 20 testimonials from experts in your field or genre. Then approach major reviewers like Publishers Weekly and Library Journal. Without those, you don't have a prayer of getting into any of those major reviewer publications. They require a four to six month lead time prior to publication, not after publication. They have to get this that much in advance in order to be able to send it out to the reviewer who's going to review it and giving that person time to do so. That lead time has stretched because of COVID almost to six to eight months. Now that we're past the kind of major COVID situation, it might be going back a little bit, but I would still put a firm line at that six months lead time at least. Now, if your book comes out before that time, they are not going to review it.

00:11:56 - Susan Friedmann

Let me clarify. Those professional reviewers are ones you actually pay for that service. Is that correct?

00:12:04 - Carol Amato

No, you don't want to pay for reviews because otherwise that's like buying an advertisement. Publishers Weekly and Library Journal. And let's see, kirkus Reviews, the New York Review of Books, book List, Forward Magazine. There's a bunch of them. And I have a handout that I would be willing to send anybody if they email me along with that freebie that I'm going to be giving out. And it'll list all these out. NetGalley is another one. Book funnel. Indie reader. I think the USA Today list is being discontinued, but I wouldn't swear to that. But those people need that lead time. And you're going to have to have those testimonials, ten to 20 of them, from those top known people, like this gentleman whose book I'm editing. Now. His field is showing at car shows. So he wants to get people like Jay Leno and other people who are car enthusiasts to give him a testimonial. He needs ten to 20 like that before he can even think about sending into the big reviewers.

00:13:12 - Susan Friedmann

They have to be names then. I mean, influencers in your field. Okay, that's interesting to know.

00:13:21 - Carol Amato

They have to be well known people. I mean, another one he could have gone after in years past is maybe Lei Akoka, who was the head of Chrysler, I believe anybody who's well known in your field. Now, you might have to start with people a little farther down the ladder in order to get those ones at the top of the ladder. But create your dream list of experts who are they? And then figure out a way to get through the line to those people.

00:13:49 - Susan Friedmann

Sometimes it's who knows who.

00:13:51 - Carol Amato

Six degrees of separation, who knows who is right. Don't start that process early. You won't have the testimonials or the reviews to put on your book cover. And that's ideally where you want to have some of these end up.

00:14:05 - Susan Friedmann

How many should be on the back of book cover. What's your recommendation?

00:14:10 - Carol Amato

Well, I think it depends on who you are. I think Stephen King can get away with nothing but reviews down the back or testimonials down the back of the COVID I think a lot of people who are reading somebody they don't know would want to see what the blurb is about, what's the content? So I would say maybe one or two I have on some of my books, one on the front, one on the back, or two on the back, and then the description of what the book content is, whether it's a novel or whether it's nonfiction. And I think that's probably the best way to go in the beginning. You can always have the rest of them inside the book.

00:14:49 - Susan Friedmann

Yes, and I've told authors that too. Doesn't mean you need to stop collecting them just because you've got a few for the back cover. Get as many as you can right.

00:15:00 - Carol Amato

And keep getting them. Yes, absolutely. You can put them on your website. The more the merrier.

00:15:06 - Susan Friedmann

How does that transfer? Let's say if somebody's got a book and they post it on Amazon and those reviews, they would need to ask the person who wrote that review to actually put it on Amazon. Would that be the case?

00:15:20 - Carol Amato

Well, not necessarily. There's a spot in Author Central where you can add your reviews in there, and as long as you have the person's name attached to it, I think I would just go ahead and load them up in that section. There's a spot in Vendor Central for the publisher to do the same thing. So if you're with a small press, ask them to put them in that publisher review section. There's ways you can get them up there, but I would just load them up, if you can yourself into the author review area and they'll appear on your page where your book is being sold.

00:15:56 - Susan Friedmann

Okay, that's good to know. I did not know that you could do that through Author Central because I think that might be a new feature because I thought, as I said in the past, that you needed to get the same person to actually go in and write it.

00:16:11 - Carol Amato

That could be the case. I mean, they're constantly changing their rules, so I would definitely check that out to make sure whether that's still there.

00:16:20 - Susan Friedmann

Contacting these reviewers. How do you go about that? Do you email them? Do you try and find somebody who can introduce you? What's the best way?

00:16:31 - Carol Amato

Well, okay, that one. Finding someone who can introduce you is a good one, but as I mentioned, I think you want to try to meet them in some form or another without asking for the review. If they're speaking at conferences or giving presentations and they happen to be in your area or somehow you can get there, I would go. But the best way is getting onto their social media sites or commenting on articles they've posted online, subscribing to their newsletters and their blogs and their social media accounts. You want to get them to recognize your name. So if you're commenting on things they've said or articles they've posted, eventually they're going to start recognizing your name. And then when you approach them, you're not coming in totally cold. You can say, you've probably seen my name as a commenter on your social media account and you've written on the XYZ topic and you're well known in this field and I'm writing a book on this topic and I wondered if you would be willing to give me a testimonial. I'd be happy to send you some sample chapters or whatever it is that you would like to see. Then hopefully they'll say yes. You can also sign up for their webinars and ask questions in the Q and A period post on the chat so they see your name. It's getting yourself known out there to these people before you approach them. Otherwise you're coming in totally cold and that person has no idea who you are or what your credibility level is at all. It would be very difficult, I think, to go in cold and get a yes. You want to try to get your name out there as much as possible with these people first. So create that list, then start getting on their social media accounts, commenting on articles they've written, or wherever else you can find them, online and in person if you can. That's the best way.

00:18:26 - Susan Friedmann

I love that strategy. I think that's a very solid strategy. It's interesting because I was fortunate, as you know, for my Riches and Niches book to get Seth Godin to give a testimonial. And of course, that's on the back cover.

00:18:42 - Carol Amato

Absolutely.

00:18:43 - Susan Friedmann

Now, he was very precise about how he wanted that used. It could only be in print. I couldn't take that and put it on my website. I couldn't take it and put it on social media or Amazon or anything like that. That was absolutely not allowed. It was just for the print on the book.

00:19:04 - Carol Amato

And I have that book right here, and I see those testimonials, and you have some fabulous ones on the back here. I mean, these are great, as you.

00:19:14 - Susan Friedmann

Said, reaching out to people. Now, I feel very blessed that I do know a lot of people, or people who know people, especially through the National Speakers Association. Yes. There's very few degrees of separation if you want somebody specific. So if you know that you want this person and that would be a right fit for you, then it would be great. It just so happened with Seth Godin that my son was a photographer when he was a keynote speaker at a National Speakers Event conference. So he loved the pictures my son took. And so I went back to him and I said, you remember that?

00:20:00 - Carol Amato

See, there you go. That's your lead in line right there.

00:20:04 - Susan Friedmann

So I must admit I was very fortunate with that. However, again, it's just for the asking. I know authors who have asked. I think one of my authors wanted Les Brown. She saw him at a conference. She asked him, and he was more than willing to do that for her.

00:20:24 - Carol Amato

Well, it's free advertising for them, of course.

00:20:27 - Susan Friedmann

Yeah.

00:20:28 - Carol Amato

That's how I got Tom Anteon on one of my books was eons ago. I went to a conference where he was speaking, because I'd been on his list forever. I thought, okay, I'm going to get to know him in person. I visited his little booth for a couple of days and just yacked up a storm. And then on the third day, I asked him, I'm writing this book for small business people. Would you be willing to give me a testimonial? He said, yes, and would you like to be in my sizzle reel for my TV show? So, I mean, there are opportunities that will come up from the other side, too. You could be invited to speak at a conference or somewhere else where that person recognizes the topic of your book and wants you to come and speak. So there's only good things that can come from making all that contact.

00:21:17 - Susan Friedmann

Yes. Carol, this is dynamite information. I know listeners would like to know how they can find out more about you. I know you'd mentioned a list of those professional reviewers which would be invaluable. So how can our listeners contact you?

00:21:36 - Carol Amato

They can email me at [email protected] right now, my other website is down, so the best way to get me is there or go to www.caroljamato.com and fill out the contact form. Either way, if you're emailing me, put book review notes in the subject line so that I'll know that that's where you came from.

00:22:06 - Susan Friedmann

And I believe you have another little giveaway.

00:22:09 - Carol Amato

Yes, I do.

00:22:10 - Susan Friedmann

Yeah.

00:22:11 - Carol Amato

And that is creating a media kit for your book, which gives you all the information you need to know to pull a media kit together because that's what some of these reviewers are going to want to see. And if you don't have that and there's a definite process to how to put it together, you will not be paid attention to at all. So it's very important. And that's a whole process in and of itself. And this is like a 50-page report that gives you all the samples and you can see what one of them looks like, and away you go. You'll be in business.

00:22:45 - Susan Friedmann

That's so generous. That's well worth it. Listeners, I would download that. I'm going to send Carol an email after this, asking her to send them to me, too, because I love these kinds of resources. So, Carol, if you were to leave our listeners with a golden nugget, what would that be?

00:23:07 - Carol Amato

My golden nugget is something that I've actually already mentioned, and that's getting those ten to 20 testimonials. It's critical for anything else to follow along. Ten to 20 testimonials and getting on.

00:23:22 - Susan Friedmann

Those social media sites, fabulous. Yes. The more exposure you can give to yourself and the book, the more people are going to find you. Find your book. And hey, you never know, as Carol said, what kind of opportunities might come of these relationships that you form with people. So. Thank you, Carol. Thank you so much for sharing your wisdom.

And listeners, if your book isn't selling the way you wanted or expected to, let's you and I jump on a quick call together to brainstorm ways to ramp up those sales, because you've invested a whole lot of time, energy and money, and it's time you got the return you were hoping for. So go to BrainstormWithSusan.com to schedule your free call. And in the meantime, I hope this powerful interview sparks some ideas you can use to sell more books. So until next week, here's wishing you much book and author marketing success.